Listen guys who think that a 2 stroke can beat a 4 stroke. IT WONT! A 2 stroke will only beat a 4 stroke off the line, but in the long run a 4 stroke will haul way more ass than a 2 stroke anyday.
how are u going to even compare a dirt bike to a slow ass quad. i dont care if u manage to match the hp of the dirt bike with your quad, but the bike weighs half as much. not to mention that the 660 has around 40hp and the rm250 pushes more than 45hp. check out some dynos, ill give you the links if u dont believe me. so basically if the rm250 weighed 375lbs it still would be beating the 660. also look at dyno charts of 4 stroke bikes like the rmz250, power is at its peak throughout most of the rpm range. yet on a 2 stroke there is a little tap of power around 7000 and then it drops back to around 10-15hp. ill give u dynos for that too. u cant compare a quad to a dirt bike. quads are always slower than dirt bikes. i could beat your 660 with my rmz250. ya that does make me smile that you tried to compare a dirt bike and a quad. sell the 660 and go all out with the rm250.
These are all good valid points! But it merley comes down to what the bike is riding on, 4 strokes are great for almost everything and so are 2 strokes! But 4 strokes should technically be off the line the fastest because they have the fly wheel wieght to add inertia to get more traction! the 2 strokes spin the tire off the line but as they hook up haul off untill they get to a certain point were the rev limiter kicks in, or the action is so fast it cannot evactuate all the engine gas's inside the cylinder. There for no more power. The 4 stroke can do this because of the cam and valves because it forces all of the burned gas's out in one stroke! The 2 stroke does what it can from the expansion of the gas's. 2 stroke is exactly what it implys ther for meaning it does what a 4 stroke does in half the time reslting in what should be twice the power! And a 2 stroke can climb just as well as a 4 stroke can........as long as its not a small 2 stroke (ex 125). My 2 stroke 250 with a flywheel weight climbs as well as 4 strokes does and mines 100% stock other than the fly wheel weight and some gearing. Basically it depends what you ride and how the bike is built. They are both good bikes! 2 or 4 stroke!
i have riden 4 strokes and 2 strokes and i prefer the 2 strokes i love the band and the rush u get from riding a 2 stroke is soo much better than a 4 the 2 stroke are lighter and have better acceleration
a 4 stroke much easier to learn on heavier and better for climbing hills
the truth is a 450f will kill a 250 2 stroke but it is almost double the size
everyone here can agree that if uu compare a 250 2 stroke and a 250f the 250f will get shitted all over
2 strokes are the biggest pos ever i mean they barley last and yer fixen em constently and the 4 stroke will walk all ove yer 2 stroke off the line and will last ya 10 times as long so you dont even now what yer talking about tigmaster
u guys are so hilarious that i had to get an account jus to tell u the truth. First i am 16 and ride a KX250. I now it top to bottom, ride too much and know way much more about it. So......... a 2-stroke has a very lightweight engine that performs best @ high rpm. We all know what rpm is right, good. For example a 250cc 2-stroke will sign off............ maybe 15000 to possible 17000 rpm(might not even sign off at all, it might blow up first), maybe i'm not sure where as a modern 4-stroke engine will sign off @ 11000 to 12000 rpm. Big difference! A 4-stroke has more moving parts meaning it puts some of it horsepower into turn those huge cams and valves with those big cam chains. By the way the typical factor horse power of a 250 2-stroke is about 40hp, a 4-stroke 450 is about 45hp. So what is the horsepower range of a 250 4-stroke? about 32-35hp and that only comes into play at about mid-range just before top-end then sign off. normally that is between 5000-8000 rpm. So will a 2-stroke beat a 4-stroke in a straight away "quarter mile" race. With the same gearing and the same rider weight, the mechanics and common sense say the 4-stroke wins off the line but the 2-stroke blows by him well before half way and scrables to grab enough brake to stop. Why are the 2-stroke never seen in the AMA, THEY HAVE BEEN BANNED!! No one rides em or can ride em because they are way to quick in the mud (if the right hands are on the bars). If you race a 250cc 2-stroke head on with a 250 4-stroke on a fairly quick MX track the 4-stroke guy will push the corners muscle through the straights and takeoff easily. The 2-stroke guy will rip down the straights, drifts the corners and could even do backflips on the jumps if he wanted. Why is that? The 4-stroke will win because if it maintains the correct speed and MOMENTUM it will beat the 2-stroke because on a snappy bike u can easily loose traction or control and u do more often on a 2-stroke than a 4-stroke. AND!!! the bike weight is pretty much the same boys and girls, no big differences, possible 2 to 3 pounds only because of the amount of fuel in the bikes and the oil nessicary in the 4-stroke crank case. 4-strokes have heavy engines and 2-strokes have light engines but need strong chassis and setups because of the ripping power of it's engine. Ride hard if it's on a 2-stroke or a 4-stroke and if it's really this big a deal go to the track and find out for urself! A 2-stroke's stroke is much larger than a 4-stroke's stroke by the way. But i think 4-stroke are kool bikes, they have basicly a specific mechanical marvel lanching them in ways most vehicles can't and a 2-stroke is a simple as simple gets, sure they need repairs alot and blow up from time to time but it's only gonna be 750 max to rebuild if u can do it urself and a 4-stroke can be anywhere from 1000 to 4000 plus! yikes!
By the way i ride with 4-strokes and i own them large, the 230's, 250's and 450's.
look a used to be a factory rider for team suzuki...and two-strokes are for the track the only reason they are not on the track any more is because of the damn emissions they put out...but if you put a two stroke and a four stroke on the track the two stroke would win every time
Hey stupid ass 2 strokes last as long as you want them to.
I have a 1996 kx 500 and it runs like brand new.
It also will smoke any dirt bike ever manufactered 2 or 4 stroke. It`ll hit 90 in 3 gear. all your 4 stroke shit cant even get close. 2 STROKES DOMINATE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Hey stupid ass 2 strokes last as long as you want them to.
I have a 1996 kx 500 and it runs like brand new.
It also will smoke any dirt bike ever manufactered 2 or 4 stroke. It`ll hit 90 in 3 gear. all your 4 stroke shit cant even get close. 2 STROKES DOMINATE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
4strokes had to lighten up the flywheel just to keep up with 2-strokes... They haven't had to change 2-strokes for years!!! Because they dot need too!! There fast the way they are.
I can't believe what shit you're all talking! Does anyone in here have a clue at all?
It's simple. 4 strokes actually rev higher than 2 strokes. They need to, otherwise they can't make the outright power. 2 strokes can't operate over wide rev range. That said, you don't get decent progress on a 4 stroke unless you're doing at least 3-4000rpm do you?
At their peaks (fair/equal capacity) a 2 stroke will make more power and torque than a 4 stroke BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT... the reasons a 4 stroke SEEMS to have more grunt are:
1. Bigger capacity (a 125cc 4 stroke is lame compared to a 125cc 2 stroke). So you have more mass spinning around.
2. The 4 stroke fires once every two crank revolutions. This gives the back wheel time to grip.
3. The power and torque curves are more linear, or flatter whichever way you look at it, so the power feeds in better and is more controllable so the HAM FISTED among you can just twist the wrist.
2 strokes have a narrower power band. There are means and ways to fix this, and to some degrees they do: ie expansion chamber, variable exhaust valve, charge trappers - some technology is still coming. 2 stroke motocross bikes are still not direct injection... whereas 4 strokes are at least FI.
2 strokes DO drop off severely, they don't need a rev limiter because they just stop of their own accord. They come on song quicker (notice I didn't say sooner), they then work against themselves later on. When they are in the band, they are making top torque and power for possibly longer than a 4 stroke BUT... a 4 stroke has been building for a lot longer. This part is psychological as well, and exactly the reason why many people just can't handle a 2 stroke.
Lets get another thing straight. A 2 stroke and 4 stroke are SO EVEN off the line that there is no point arguing. There are too many factors, but lets say equal riders and conditions, the 4 stroke SHOULD have a SLIGHT advantage because it can get better traction (remember the points above) from lower revs. What the 4 stroke doesn't have is a big gob of horsepower and torque spinning like crazy - it's a different kind of inertia. Given we have knobby tyres, this can result in a takeoff just as quick. Remember the rip-cord toys we had as a kid - that's kinda what a 2 stroke is.
Top end speed is also a MOOT point. Because a 4 stroke has a wider spread of power, 2 strokes need more gears. A 4 stroke will have a slight advantage - maybe 5-10km/h. Seriously though, can anyone chime in with some REAL figures here?
I have spent some time on CR250 and a little time on a scary fun as fuck CR500. Both were damned quick. I know an NX650 Dominator is not the same as a YZF450 or whatever, but with a pipe and better jets it was not much quicker than a CR250 in straight line.
It all comes down to horses for courses. Tell me that the regulations are even, go on! If they were racing same capacity, we all know what the outcome would be. Same deal with 500GP/MotoGP. If 2 strokes were still developed, they would be giving the 800cc 4 strokes a run. Maybe not beating them all the time, but...
Tell me I am a dickhead all you like. Talk to the experts and then get back to me. All these arguments are is shit talk. You'll find me in the other thread about this. Yeah I like 2 strokes more. Would I do a Dakar on a 2 stroke? Probably not, I would pick a 4 stroke for that.
More cents than dollars... and I like stirring healthy debate.. not mass-debate.
4 strokes pull off the bottom and medium end faster and quick. A 2 stroke needs time to wind out and get going. that's why when 2 strokes are raced they need to be whined out all the time( they have to be in the high rpm's to stay moving fast enough). 4 strokes are definitely a better choice for motocross. At the gate the 4 strokes will pull you out of the hole quicker. you never get to use all your top end in a race at a motocross track. if you were to drag(depending on how long of a drag), id probably choose a 2 stroke because you will get the 4 stroke on top end (only). IF it was a short drag id take the 4 stroke over the 2 stroke because id guarantee you will come out of the hole quicker. but then again you can gear a 2 stroke so that yo can get better bottom end. but stock the 4 stroke gets you out of the hole. idc what any1 says.
Look, I normaly dont waste my time on this subject but in my opinion........ Fout strokes are better. There are pros and cons to both bikes and I have owned them all. Two strokes use too damn much gas. I couldnt even go riding allday on my ktm250sx because it could go thru a tank of gas in an hour and a half. My crf250x can run aalll day on one tank and half the next day too. I raced my buddys yz125 repeatedly and I always win no matter what. Also, I am able to take a turn way faster on my crf than my sx because the power is way more tracable out of the turn as well as the engine breaking helping me carry more momentum into the turn. The only time a two stroke is better is rebuild time. Thas it but I still love two strokes and I love the competion.
im an owner of both kinds of bikes and i think they are both equal. if i was going to race on the track i would use a 4 stroke but if i was going to drag race or something i would use a 2 stroke. There realy is no super engine. 2 stroke has amazing acceleration and speed but doesnt last as long as a four stroke engine also you are constantly mixing gas with a two stroke. But a four stroke needs no mixing fuels and lasts longer but being more reliable comes with a price 4 strokes take a while to catch up to a 2 stroke but can and there is a reason why they call 4 strokes thumpers SLOW.
You only say that because you have a 2 stroke... a 2 stroke is unreliable and brakes A-LOT easier than a 4-stroke, and the sound the 2-stokes make... let's don't even talk about that. 2-strokes need a lot of oil and it always pissed me off to mix it... And the question is, why will the companies only manufacture 4-strokes these days??? my personal opinion is a 4-stroke.
(Reply to "unbeatable racer" 1# page)
how are u going to even compa
how are u going to even compare a dirt bike to a slow ass quad. i dont care if u manage to match the hp of the dirt bike with your quad, but the bike weighs half as much. not to mention that the 660 has around 40hp and the rm250 pushes more than 45hp. check out some dynos, ill give you the links if u dont believe me. so basically if the rm250 weighed 375lbs it still would be beating the 660. also look at dyno charts of 4 stroke bikes like the rmz250, power is at its peak throughout most of the rpm range. yet on a 2 stroke there is a little tap of power around 7000 and then it drops back to around 10-15hp. ill give u dynos for that too. u cant compare a quad to a dirt bike. quads are always slower than dirt bikes. i could beat your 660 with my rmz250. ya that does make me smile that you tried to compare a dirt bike and a quad. sell the 660 and go all out with the rm250.
---Mototips March Giveaway, Check It Out Here---
ur a retard the only reason t
ur a retard the only reason there r 250 lites instead of 125s is bcuz 2 strokes are no longer being manufactured
people
Impossible is nothing
These are all good valid poin
These are all good valid points! But it merley comes down to what the bike is riding on, 4 strokes are great for almost everything and so are 2 strokes! But 4 strokes should technically be off the line the fastest because they have the fly wheel wieght to add inertia to get more traction! the 2 strokes spin the tire off the line but as they hook up haul off untill they get to a certain point were the rev limiter kicks in, or the action is so fast it cannot evactuate all the engine gas's inside the cylinder. There for no more power. The 4 stroke can do this because of the cam and valves because it forces all of the burned gas's out in one stroke! The 2 stroke does what it can from the expansion of the gas's. 2 stroke is exactly what it implys ther for meaning it does what a 4 stroke does in half the time reslting in what should be twice the power! And a 2 stroke can climb just as well as a 4 stroke can........as long as its not a small 2 stroke (ex 125). My 2 stroke 250 with a flywheel weight climbs as well as 4 strokes does and mines 100% stock other than the fly wheel weight and some gearing. Basically it depends what you ride and how the bike is built. They are both good bikes! 2 or 4 stroke!
a 4 stroke is double the cc's
a 4 stroke is double the cc's too so why dont you take a 125 4stroke and a 125 2 stroke and race then see what happens
what the fuck bat, that afor
what the fuck bat, that afor stroke and twostroke 125 cant be compared.
the truth about 2 and four strokes
i have riden 4 strokes and 2 strokes and i prefer the 2 strokes i love the band and the rush u get from riding a 2 stroke is soo much better than a 4 the 2 stroke are lighter and have better acceleration
a 4 stroke much easier to learn on heavier and better for climbing hills
the truth is a 450f will kill a 250 2 stroke but it is almost double the size
everyone here can agree that if uu compare a 250 2 stroke and a 250f the 250f will get shitted all over
remember FUCK THE WHALES SAVE THE 2 STROKES
2 strokes are the biggest
2 strokes are the biggest pos ever i mean they barley last and yer fixen em constently and the 4 stroke will walk all ove yer 2 stroke off the line and will last ya 10 times as long so you dont even now what yer talking about tigmaster
holy shit
u guys are so hilarious that i had to get an account jus to tell u the truth. First i am 16 and ride a KX250. I now it top to bottom, ride too much and know way much more about it. So......... a 2-stroke has a very lightweight engine that performs best @ high rpm. We all know what rpm is right, good. For example a 250cc 2-stroke will sign off............ maybe 15000 to possible 17000 rpm(might not even sign off at all, it might blow up first), maybe i'm not sure where as a modern 4-stroke engine will sign off @ 11000 to 12000 rpm. Big difference! A 4-stroke has more moving parts meaning it puts some of it horsepower into turn those huge cams and valves with those big cam chains. By the way the typical factor horse power of a 250 2-stroke is about 40hp, a 4-stroke 450 is about 45hp. So what is the horsepower range of a 250 4-stroke? about 32-35hp and that only comes into play at about mid-range just before top-end then sign off. normally that is between 5000-8000 rpm. So will a 2-stroke beat a 4-stroke in a straight away "quarter mile" race. With the same gearing and the same rider weight, the mechanics and common sense say the 4-stroke wins off the line but the 2-stroke blows by him well before half way and scrables to grab enough brake to stop. Why are the 2-stroke never seen in the AMA, THEY HAVE BEEN BANNED!! No one rides em or can ride em because they are way to quick in the mud (if the right hands are on the bars). If you race a 250cc 2-stroke head on with a 250 4-stroke on a fairly quick MX track the 4-stroke guy will push the corners muscle through the straights and takeoff easily. The 2-stroke guy will rip down the straights, drifts the corners and could even do backflips on the jumps if he wanted. Why is that? The 4-stroke will win because if it maintains the correct speed and MOMENTUM it will beat the 2-stroke because on a snappy bike u can easily loose traction or control and u do more often on a 2-stroke than a 4-stroke. AND!!! the bike weight is pretty much the same boys and girls, no big differences, possible 2 to 3 pounds only because of the amount of fuel in the bikes and the oil nessicary in the 4-stroke crank case. 4-strokes have heavy engines and 2-strokes have light engines but need strong chassis and setups because of the ripping power of it's engine. Ride hard if it's on a 2-stroke or a 4-stroke and if it's really this big a deal go to the track and find out for urself! A 2-stroke's stroke is much larger than a 4-stroke's stroke by the way. But i think 4-stroke are kool bikes, they have basicly a specific mechanical marvel lanching them in ways most vehicles can't and a 2-stroke is a simple as simple gets, sure they need repairs alot and blow up from time to time but it's only gonna be 750 max to rebuild if u can do it urself and a 4-stroke can be anywhere from 1000 to 4000 plus! yikes!
By the way i ride with 4-strokes and i own them large, the 230's, 250's and 450's.
haha
hahahaha you lads make me laugh so much, your like a bunch of school girls all bitchin at each other
made my day. keep it up haha
Ben
two-strokes are for the track
look a used to be a factory rider for team suzuki...and two-strokes are for the track the only reason they are not on the track any more is because of the damn emissions they put out...but if you put a two stroke and a four stroke on the track the two stroke would win every time
2 strokes vs four strokes
dude 2 strokes are better than the four stokes in an all out race. no question asked
2 strokes last long
Hey stupid ass 2 strokes last as long as you want them to.
I have a 1996 kx 500 and it runs like brand new.
It also will smoke any dirt bike ever manufactered 2 or 4 stroke. It`ll hit 90 in 3 gear. all your 4 stroke shit cant even get close. 2 STROKES DOMINATE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
2 strokes last long
Hey stupid ass 2 strokes last as long as you want them to.
I have a 1996 kx 500 and it runs like brand new.
It also will smoke any dirt bike ever manufactered 2 or 4 stroke. It`ll hit 90 in 3 gear. all your 4 stroke shit cant even get close. 2 STROKES DOMINATE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
i am getting a 4 stroke but i
i am getting a 4 stroke but i still know 2 stroke are better
2-stroke ftw!
4strokes had to lighten up the flywheel just to keep up with 2-strokes... They haven't had to change 2-strokes for years!!! Because they dot need too!! There fast the way they are.
I can't believe what shit
I can't believe what shit you're all talking! Does anyone in here have a clue at all?
It's simple. 4 strokes actually rev higher than 2 strokes. They need to, otherwise they can't make the outright power. 2 strokes can't operate over wide rev range. That said, you don't get decent progress on a 4 stroke unless you're doing at least 3-4000rpm do you?
At their peaks (fair/equal capacity) a 2 stroke will make more power and torque than a 4 stroke BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT... the reasons a 4 stroke SEEMS to have more grunt are:
1. Bigger capacity (a 125cc 4 stroke is lame compared to a 125cc 2 stroke). So you have more mass spinning around.
2. The 4 stroke fires once every two crank revolutions. This gives the back wheel time to grip.
3. The power and torque curves are more linear, or flatter whichever way you look at it, so the power feeds in better and is more controllable so the HAM FISTED among you can just twist the wrist.
2 strokes have a narrower power band. There are means and ways to fix this, and to some degrees they do: ie expansion chamber, variable exhaust valve, charge trappers - some technology is still coming. 2 stroke motocross bikes are still not direct injection... whereas 4 strokes are at least FI.
2 strokes DO drop off severely, they don't need a rev limiter because they just stop of their own accord. They come on song quicker (notice I didn't say sooner), they then work against themselves later on. When they are in the band, they are making top torque and power for possibly longer than a 4 stroke BUT... a 4 stroke has been building for a lot longer. This part is psychological as well, and exactly the reason why many people just can't handle a 2 stroke.
Lets get another thing straight. A 2 stroke and 4 stroke are SO EVEN off the line that there is no point arguing. There are too many factors, but lets say equal riders and conditions, the 4 stroke SHOULD have a SLIGHT advantage because it can get better traction (remember the points above) from lower revs. What the 4 stroke doesn't have is a big gob of horsepower and torque spinning like crazy - it's a different kind of inertia. Given we have knobby tyres, this can result in a takeoff just as quick. Remember the rip-cord toys we had as a kid - that's kinda what a 2 stroke is.
Top end speed is also a MOOT point. Because a 4 stroke has a wider spread of power, 2 strokes need more gears. A 4 stroke will have a slight advantage - maybe 5-10km/h. Seriously though, can anyone chime in with some REAL figures here?
I have spent some time on CR250 and a little time on a scary fun as fuck CR500. Both were damned quick. I know an NX650 Dominator is not the same as a YZF450 or whatever, but with a pipe and better jets it was not much quicker than a CR250 in straight line.
It all comes down to horses for courses. Tell me that the regulations are even, go on! If they were racing same capacity, we all know what the outcome would be. Same deal with 500GP/MotoGP. If 2 strokes were still developed, they would be giving the 800cc 4 strokes a run. Maybe not beating them all the time, but...
Tell me I am a dickhead all you like. Talk to the experts and then get back to me. All these arguments are is shit talk. You'll find me in the other thread about this. Yeah I like 2 strokes more. Would I do a Dakar on a 2 stroke? Probably not, I would pick a 4 stroke for that.
More cents than dollars... and I like stirring healthy debate.. not mass-debate.
4vs 2 strokes
4 strokes pull off the bottom and medium end faster and quick. A 2 stroke needs time to wind out and get going. that's why when 2 strokes are raced they need to be whined out all the time( they have to be in the high rpm's to stay moving fast enough). 4 strokes are definitely a better choice for motocross. At the gate the 4 strokes will pull you out of the hole quicker. you never get to use all your top end in a race at a motocross track. if you were to drag(depending on how long of a drag), id probably choose a 2 stroke because you will get the 4 stroke on top end (only). IF it was a short drag id take the 4 stroke over the 2 stroke because id guarantee you will come out of the hole quicker. but then again you can gear a 2 stroke so that yo can get better bottom end. but stock the 4 stroke gets you out of the hole. idc what any1 says.
Look, I normaly dont waste my
Look, I normaly dont waste my time on this subject but in my opinion........ Fout strokes are better. There are pros and cons to both bikes and I have owned them all. Two strokes use too damn much gas. I couldnt even go riding allday on my ktm250sx because it could go thru a tank of gas in an hour and a half. My crf250x can run aalll day on one tank and half the next day too. I raced my buddys yz125 repeatedly and I always win no matter what. Also, I am able to take a turn way faster on my crf than my sx because the power is way more tracable out of the turn as well as the engine breaking helping me carry more momentum into the turn. The only time a two stroke is better is rebuild time. Thas it but I still love two strokes and I love the competion.
aaaaaaahh
im an owner of both kinds of bikes and i think they are both equal. if i was going to race on the track i would use a 4 stroke but if i was going to drag race or something i would use a 2 stroke. There realy is no super engine. 2 stroke has amazing acceleration and speed but doesnt last as long as a four stroke engine also you are constantly mixing gas with a two stroke. But a four stroke needs no mixing fuels and lasts longer but being more reliable comes with a price 4 strokes take a while to catch up to a 2 stroke but can and there is a reason why they call 4 strokes thumpers SLOW.
You only say that because you
You only say that because you have a 2 stroke... a 2 stroke is unreliable and brakes A-LOT easier than a 4-stroke, and the sound the 2-stokes make... let's don't even talk about that. 2-strokes need a lot of oil and it always pissed me off to mix it... And the question is, why will the companies only manufacture 4-strokes these days??? my personal opinion is a 4-stroke.
(Reply to "unbeatable racer" 1# page)
Reason 2 Strokes are banned
They are banned because they give off tooo many emmissions. they are enviromentally unfriendly. : (
What my kx 125 smokes a 2005
What my kx 125 smokes a 2005 yz250 f set up for race take off and long run